Cash - On the way out.

[KhunDon]

£45 contactless is just fine for me and if I need to spend more, well, it only takes 5 seconds to put the card in and tap in my PIN number. 
Everyone seems to be in such a hurry these day’s. 
“Touch and go” describes my sex life at the moment. 🤣

[boydeste]

1 hour ago, galenkia said:

Think £100 is too high for contactless payments. Gonna lose £300 before you have to enter the pin if your card is lost or stolen. 

And good luck in getting it refunded back in to your account. 

I agree, the whole concept is based around fraud control and being able to loose 300 notes and posibly more doesn't appeal to me either.

[Lantern]

HERES WHAT NO CASH ACTUALLY MEANS

A cashless society means no cash. Zero. It doesn’t mean mostly cashless and you can still use a ‘wee bit of cash here & there’. Cashless means fully digital, fully traceable, fully controlled. I think those who support a cashless society aren’t fully aware of what they are asking for. A cashless society means:

* If you are struggling with your mortgage on a particular month, you can’t do an odd job to get you through.

* Your child can’t go & help the local farmer to earn a bit of summer cash.

* No more cash slipped into the hands of a child as a good luck charm or from their grandparent when going on holidays.

* No more money in birthday cards.

* No more piggy banks for your child to collect pocket money & to learn about the value of earning.

* No more cash for a rainy day fund or for that something special you have been putting £20 a week away for.

* No more fivers on the side because your wages barely cover the bills or put food on the table.

* No more charity collections.

* No more selling bits & pieces from your home that you no longer want/need for a bit of cash in return.

* No more cash gifts from relatives or loved ones.

What a cashless society does guarantee:

* Banks have full control of every single penny you own.

* Every transaction you make is recorded.

* All your movements & actions are traceable.

* Access to your money can be blocked at the click of a button when/if banks need ‘clarification’ from you which will take about 3 weeks, a thousand questions answered & five thousand passwords.

* You will have no choice but to declare & be taxed on every pound in your possession.

* The government WILL decide what you can & cannot purchase.

* If your transactions are deemed in any way questionable, by those who create the questions, your money will be frozen, ‘for your own good’.

I could write lists for 5 days & still not finish explaining how utterly awful a cashless society would be, for everyone. Even for the goody two shoes who wouldn’t dream of not declaring £500.
Forget about cash being dirty. Stop being so easily led. Cash has been around for a very, very, very long time & it gives you control over how you trade with the world. It gives you independence. I heard a story where a man supposedly contracted Covid because of a £20 note he had handled. There is the same chance of Covid being on a card as being on cash. If you cannot see how utterly ridiculous this assumption is then there is little hope.

If you are a customer, pay with cash. If you are a shop owner, remove those ridiculous signs that ask people to pay by card. Cash is a legal tender, it is our right to pay with cash. Banks are making it increasingly difficult to lodge cash & that has nothing to do with a virus, nor has this ‘dirty money’ trend.

Please open your eyes. Please stop believing everything you are being told. Almost every single topic in today’s world is tainted with corruption & hidden agendas. Please stop telling me & others like me that we are what’s wrong with the world when you hail the most corrupt members of society as your heroes. Politics & greed is what is wrong with the world; not those who are trying to alert you to the reality in which you are blindly floating along whilst being immobilised by irrational fear. Fear created to keep you doing & believing in exactly what you are complacently doing.

Pay with cash & please say no to a cashless society while you still have the choice.

 

 

[Stillearly]

7 minutes ago, Lantern said:

HERES WHAT NO CASH ACTUALLY MEANS

A cashless society means no cash. Zero. It doesn’t mean mostly cashless and you can still use a ‘wee bit of cash here & there’. Cashless means fully digital, fully traceable, fully controlled. I think those who support a cashless society aren’t fully aware of what they are asking for. A cashless society means:

* If you are struggling with your mortgage on a particular month, you can’t do an odd job to get you through.

* Your child can’t go & help the local farmer to earn a bit of summer cash.

* No more cash slipped into the hands of a child as a good luck charm or from their grandparent when going on holidays.

* No more money in birthday cards.

* No more piggy banks for your child to collect pocket money & to learn about the value of earning.

* No more cash for a rainy day fund or for that something special you have been putting £20 a week away for.

* No more fivers on the side because your wages barely cover the bills or put food on the table.

* No more charity collections.

* No more selling bits & pieces from your home that you no longer want/need for a bit of cash in return.

* No more cash gifts from relatives or loved ones.

What a cashless society does guarantee:

* Banks have full control of every single penny you own.

* Every transaction you make is recorded.

* All your movements & actions are traceable.

* Access to your money can be blocked at the click of a button when/if banks need ‘clarification’ from you which will take about 3 weeks, a thousand questions answered & five thousand passwords.

* You will have no choice but to declare & be taxed on every pound in your possession.

* The government WILL decide what you can & cannot purchase.

* If your transactions are deemed in any way questionable, by those who create the questions, your money will be frozen, ‘for your own good’.

I could write lists for 5 days & still not finish explaining how utterly awful a cashless society would be, for everyone. Even for the goody two shoes who wouldn’t dream of not declaring £500.
Forget about cash being dirty. Stop being so easily led. Cash has been around for a very, very, very long time & it gives you control over how you trade with the world. It gives you independence. I heard a story where a man supposedly contracted Covid because of a £20 note he had handled. There is the same chance of Covid being on a card as being on cash. If you cannot see how utterly ridiculous this assumption is then there is little hope.

If you are a customer, pay with cash. If you are a shop owner, remove those ridiculous signs that ask people to pay by card. Cash is a legal tender, it is our right to pay with cash. Banks are making it increasingly difficult to lodge cash & that has nothing to do with a virus, nor has this ‘dirty money’ trend.

Please open your eyes. Please stop believing everything you are being told. Almost every single topic in today’s world is tainted with corruption & hidden agendas. Please stop telling me & others like me that we are what’s wrong with the world when you hail the most corrupt members of society as your heroes. Politics & greed is what is wrong with the world; not those who are trying to alert you to the reality in which you are blindly floating along whilst being immobilised by irrational fear. Fear created to keep you doing & believing in exactly what you are complacently doing.

Pay with cash & please say no to a cashless society while you still have the choice.

 

 

I assume a copy and paste of something you have seen on FB 😉 

[Lantern]

^ Yes, but couldn't remember exactly where I saved it from.

[KWA]

4 hours ago, Lantern said:

^ Yes, but couldn't remember exactly where I saved it from.

It doesn't matter - if it was on the internet it must be true according to many. 🙂

 

[bexwell]

The companies that provide contactless infrastructure charge for every transaction , if it was a penny a transaction (I'm sure it is in the uk) that would be £600,000 a day for one transaction each (in the uk alone).

[john luke]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-56263582

Budget 2021: Contactless card limit will rise to £100

By Kevin Peachey
Personal finance correspondent, BBC News

 

 

The limit on a single payment using contactless card technology will rise to £100 later this year, the Treasury has confirmed.

The pandemic has accelerated a move away from cash, with shoppers often being encouraged to use contactless in many stores for public health reasons.

It has been less than a year since the limit was raised from £30 to £45.

Regulators say businesses could still decide themselves whether to accept the higher limit.

Fears have also been raised regarding fraud risks involved in the use of cards.

• Cash refusal 'creeping into UK economy'
• Will we be getting our cash from shops, not ATMs?

The use of contactless technology by consumers has risen sharply in recent years, with more services adopting the technology and most shops offering it as an option.

To protect workers and consumers during the Covid outbreak, an increase to the current limit of £45 was rushed through by the regulator in April last year.

The latest figures show that the proportion of contactless payments had fallen slightly compared with pre-pandemic levels, because lockdown measures hit the use of pubs, restaurants and public transport. They accounted for 41% of card transactions.

However, there was a 16% increase in the total value of contactless payments in the UK in October, compared with the same month a year earlier, according to the latest data from UK Finance, which represents banks.

The amount spent on contactless hit a monthly record in August, boosted by the Eat Out to Help Out scheme and fewer coronavirus-related restrictions. A total of £8.4bn was spent on credit and debit cards using contactless during that month.

Chancellor Rishi Sunak said: "As we begin to open the UK economy and people return to the High Street, the contactless limit increase will make it easier than ever before for people to pay for their shopping, providing a welcome boost to retail that will protect jobs and drive growth."

However, there have been worries raised about contactless limits being raised further.

Ian Johnson, managing director, Europe, at payment business Marqeta, said: "The problem with increasing limits on physical contactless cards is if they are stolen or cloned, it will now be even easier for a fraudster to spend large sums of the victim's money in one go.

"Physical cards provide very little security and a fraudster could continue to use their contactless function until they are cancelled."

 

 

 

[KhunDon]

We rarely use cash now and spend mostly on bank visa contactless cards. 
Any large purchase in shops or over the tinternet that are over £100 we tend to purchase on my wife’s Credit Card (I don’t have a Credit Card 😟) and pay it off in full by the end of the month, this gives us the added security of claiming it back from the bank of it all goes tits up. 
My Bank Visa Debit card is used for day to day small purchases of £45 or under, which is a bit annoying when filling the car up with petrol, as it takes £75 a time, so I’d welcome a ride to £100 at any one time.
I believe, but I’m not 100% sure, that Debit cards are covered under Section 75 of the Bank regulations and money can be claimed back when purchasing on the card if problems arise.

I’ve had my Debit card cloned a few years ago at a BP Petrol station by a cashier, as had over 2,000+ customers.
However, NatWest returned the funds to my account within a few days after the scam was investigated by the police. I also had compensation from BP.
We change our PIN numbers on our cards on a regular basis as another way to secure our card details, but the banks should do a lot more in the way of security for these cards, but instead, they seem happy to just sit back and pay out for fraudulent activities, rather than installing much better card security. 
 

[john luke]

2 hours ago, KhunDon said:

We rarely use cash now and spend mostly on bank visa contactless cards. 
Any large purchase in shops or over the tinternet that are over £100 we tend to purchase on my wife’s Credit Card (I don’t have a Credit Card 😟) and pay it off in full by the end of the month, this gives us the added security of claiming it back from the bank of it all goes tits up. 
My Bank Visa Debit card is used for day to day small purchases of £45 or under, which is a bit annoying when filling the car up with petrol, as it takes £75 a time, so I’d welcome a ride to £100 at any one time.
I believe, but I’m not 100% sure, that Debit cards are covered under Section 75 of the Bank regulations and money can be claimed back when purchasing on the card if problems arise.

I’ve had my Debit card cloned a few years ago at a BP Petrol station by a cashier, as had over 2,000+ customers.
However, NatWest returned the funds to my account within a few days after the scam was investigated by the police. I also had compensation from BP.
We change our PIN numbers on our cards on a regular basis as another way to secure our card details, but the banks should do a lot more in the way of security for these cards, but instead, they seem happy to just sit back and pay out for fraudulent activities, rather than installing much better card security. 
 

The below is fairly clear, however s75 is a different process to chargeback.

 

https://www.thinkmoney.co.uk/blog/whats-the-difference-between-section-75-and-chargeback/

What's chargeback?

Through the chargeback scheme, you can get your money back from your bank or building society (or alternative provider like thinkmoney) if something goes wrong with a purchase you make on your debit card.

This covers you if you buy faulty or counterfeit goods, goods from a company that goes bust or pay for a service that you don't receive. You can get protection through the chargeback scheme on a Visa, Maestro or MasterCard debit card. You can also get your money back through certain credit card or prepaid card providers.

The chargeback scheme is not a legal requirement but a voluntary agreement between card providers and card issuers who set the rules for the scheme.

What's Section 75?

Section 75 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 is a UK law. It protects you on any purchases that you make on your credit card between the value of £100 and £30,000. Under Section 75, the credit provider and the retailer are equally liable if something goes wrong with your purchase.

This means if you order something and the retailer goes bust, you can claim your money back from the credit card provider. The same goes for if you order something that doesn't arrive or is faulty when it does. You don't even have to spend the full amount on your credit card – paying in part on your credit card could see you claim for the full amount, just as long as it costs between £100 and £30,000.

What are the main differences?

One of the main differences between Section 75 and the chargeback scheme is that one is law and the other is a voluntary agreement. This means you have more legal protection with Section 75 as it is enshrined in law – credit card providers have to follow it.

There is a limit on the amount of cover you can receive under Section 75. You can only make a claim on purchases between the value of £100 and £30,000, while under the chargeback scheme you can claim for any amount. You must claim through the chargeback scheme within 120 days of your purchase or payment for service. But there is no time limit with Section 75.

As we've mentioned, even if you only pay for an item or service in part on your credit card, you can get protection for the whole cost under Section 75. To make a claim under the chargeback scheme, you'll need to pay for the full amount on your debit or credit card.

If you are unsuccessful with making a claim on either scheme, you can appeal to the Financial Ombudsman service.

[KhunDon]

Yes mate, I did know section 75 was different to Chargeback, as I’d used it (Chargeback) for an engine component I’d bought for a Jaguar car from a chap who went bust and the bank voluntarily gave me the money back without any argument. Once I had a dispute with PayPal for an item that never turned up and PayPal disputed the problem and that was done on my Debit card. The bank decided to reimburse me via Chargeback and paid the money straight into my account. 
On the section 75, we always pay at least £100 on the credit card for costly items, just in case something goes wrong, then we can claim the full amount back from the card provider. 
🤗

Edited March 3, 2021 by KhunDon

[john luke]

Apologies @KhunDon, post was more for general information for everyone.  The ambiguity, I think is when a transaction involves an agent, rather than a direct trade between buyer and seller/service provider.  There was a post on here some time ago involving an agent.  My thoughts were that purchaser would not get his money back; few days later purchaser posted that he had money refunded.  Clearly banks are interested in their reputation and seem to offer more than they are legally obliged to do.

[KhunDon]

  No problem mate. 👍

The dispute I had with PayPal was going nowhere, but then I spoke to my bank and they said that rather than them take up a protracted dispute with PayPal, the bank would pay me the money from a fund they have for just these type of problems, as the original payment was taken from my Visa Debit account card which was registered with PayPal. 
No wonder they pay such little interest on accounts. 😉

[Pinoydave]

Quite a few Pattaya tourists are spending cash....... acquired one way or another..... hopefully legally.... but generally cash that we don’t want to pay tax on !!

If all this money has to go through bank accounts and tax be paid..... it will ultimately have quite an effect on fun places like Pattaya.

even smart pensioners who’ve in the past stashed cash away in a suitcase won’t have the same spending power....

[Stillearly]

Not just any bananas...

https://metro.co.uk/2021/03/21/ms-customer-charged-1599-for-1-bunch-of-bananas-in-london-14278245/

 

A Marks and Spencer customer was left gobsmacked when she was charged £1,599 for a £1 bunch of bananas. Cymbre Barnes, 28, was in a rush as she tapped her phone on the card reader to buy the fruit with Apple Pay at a self-checkout in a London store. She did a ‘double-take’ after seeing how much she had been charged after the sale immediately flashed up on her phone. She had spent £1,602 on her shopping in total. After turning to staff to fix the mistake, she was told the only till in the shop was broken.

 

The Londoner was forced to walk 45 minutes to the next nearest M&S to get a refund. She told The Telegraph: ‘I was in a rush before work so when I got to self-checkout I used contactless and it was instant. ‘I did a double-take when I saw the screen but by then my receipt was already being printed. It was too late.’ There is no spending limit with Apple pay, although some retailers place a £45 maximum on purchases.

 

 

 

 

 

[john luke]

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-62576024

Cash use set to survive pandemic slump

The rapid decline in the use of cash during the pandemic has eased as consumers return to their preferred method of paying for things, a report suggests.

Many people were forced into trying alternative ways of spending owing to Covid restrictions, banking trade body UK Finance said.

But it added that their preferred method had not changed radically.

Cash use is still forecast to drop, accounting for 6% of payments by 2031.

"Rather than the UK becoming a cash-free society over the next decade, the UK will transition to an economy where cash is less important than it once was but remains valued and preferred by many," the report said.

Covid impact

The trend of the last decade has been the significant rise in the prevalence of card - and particularly contactless - payments. Debit or credit cards were used in 57% of all payments in the UK last year.

 

In comparison, the use of notes and coins has dropped from 55% of payments in 2011 to 15% last year.

 

 

During the pandemic, the number of payments made in total fell. In particular, cash use slumped during lockdowns and as retailers encouraged friction-free payments.

• 'I've taught my mum some things about finance'
• Warning millions would struggle if cash phased out

Now, the UK Finance report suggests that long-term trends will continue as if there has been no pandemic impact.

While 42% of consumers only made one transaction or fewer in cash each month, Adrian Buckle, head of research at UK Finance, said that many people were returning to their first preference when paying.

"Payment trends generally tend to change slowly, as we all form habits about the way we pay for things and these don't change easily," he said.

Natalie Ceeney, who leads work into access to cash, said: "It's now widely recognised that those who rely on cash tend to be older, poorer or more vulnerable, many of whom simply can't 'go digital'. 

 

"I'm really pleased that, after many years of campaigning on the issue, the industry is working hard to put in solutions and we should finally have legislation to protect access to cash in the next few months."

Budgets squeezed

Another factor in the use of cash is the rising cost of living.

Mr Buckle said cash became slightly more popular during the financial crisis at the start of the last decade but, like then, it had relatively little impact on the longer term decline.

The Post Office recently reported that its counters handled £801m in personal cash withdrawals in July, the most since records began five years ago.

It said customers' use of cash to budget and the popularity of staycations were behind the increase.

In May, Salford University student Kira Hayward told the BBC that she turned to social media for inspiration to help her cope with rising costs by taking cash out of her bank account.

She puts it in different labelled envelopes to ensure she has money for food and bills. 

"I went on Instagram and YouTube and I saw these physical budget binders," she said. "I take the money out of the bank and I budget for things like my shopping. If I know I have £80 in my personal shopping for the month I know I can't go over that." 

However, the UK Finance report suggested that young people were becoming adept at budgeting using smartphone apps and were keeping a keen eye on their bank balance digitally.

Mr Buckle said they would log into accounts several times a day. Instead of using cash to budget, many would consider any cash withdrawals as money already "spent" as it had already reduced the bank balance they saw on the screen.

The report also questioned the assumption that younger people were more reliant than others on Buy Now, Pay Later products. The trade body's limited research suggested about one in eight people had used these services, but they were most likely to be aged between 35 and 44.

 

 

[john luke]

Whilst over in UK for three months earlier this year, I hardly used cash at all.  I am quite happy to use plastic and Apple Pay.

Thailand is different; non cash payment is not available everywhere, but from personal observation I think the opportunities to use non cash payment are increasing.

What do members think?

 

[KWA]

1 hour ago, john luke said:

Thailand is different; non cash payment is not available everywhere, but from personal observation I think the opportunities to use non cash payment are increasing.

What do members think?

Definitely increasing.  From restaurants and shops to food carts and taxis, there are options to pay using your phone appearing everywhere now, and I see them getting used more and more by locals and visitors alike.

Still too many seem lost and take forever to do it however, when they could have handed over cash and received change in half the time.

Edited August 18, 2022 by KWA

[Pumpuynarak]

Cash is king for me and always will be unless buying online with no COD but i am an old git set in his ways lol

I cannot forget my recent time spent in the UK staying at my son's house, he was away up country and i needed a taxi so he said no probs dad i'll order one for you. Well the taxi turned up on time and took me to my destination and i asked the driver "how much do i owe you" he said its already been paid for !!!

I could'nt wait to get back to Thailand and its cash payments lol 

[Pumpuynarak]

2 minutes ago, KWA said:

Still too many seem lost and take forever to do it however, when they could have handed over cash and received change in half the time.

and they call cashless payments PROGRESS lol

[Lantern]

Last February we had two floods in a couple of months. All communications were down, no internet, no phones, nothing. All shops had cash as the only option.  I had cash but couldn't get to it until the creeks went down a couple of days later. Quite a surreal time. 

[Jambo]

5 hours ago, Pumpuynarak said:

Cash is king for me and always will be unless buying online with no COD but i am an old git set in his ways lol

I cannot forget my recent time spent in the UK staying at my son's house, he was away up country and i needed a taxi so he said no probs dad i'll order one for you. Well the taxi turned up on time and took me to my destination and i asked the driver "how much do i owe you" he said its already been paid for !!!

I could'nt wait to get back to Thailand and its cash payments lol 

I spent my first 10 days on my return to the UK in quarantine as per the then rules.

On day 11 I got on a bus to go to the "walk in" vaccination center for my first covid jag presenting a five pound note to the driver for my £1:80 fare. 

"Exact fare - no change pal. Pay by credit card."

"I don't have a bank card yet", says I as Bank of Scotland was my next port of call. 

" Take a seat ." says he. " Nobody pays cash these days."

He was so right even down to paying by card for a single pint in my local.

My "old farts" free bus card turned up a couple of days later which I make good use.

My local pharmacy has a large sign stating "Please pay by card."

[bob lt]

I am amazed when people pay for a single pint of beer by card, even more amazed when they pay with their phone.

When forced to use self-checkout at my local supermarket, I go to a terminal that allows payment by cash or card. If it is faulty and announces 'this till will only accept payment by card' I leave my shopping at the till and depart.

Yes, I am old, that will not change and neither will I.

[Butch]

8 hours ago, bob lt said:

I am amazed when people pay for a single pint of beer by card, even more amazed when they pay with their phone.

When forced to use self-checkout at my local supermarket, I go to a terminal that allows payment by cash or card. If it is faulty and announces 'this till will only accept payment by card' I leave my shopping at the till and depart.

Yes, I am old, that will not change and neither will I.

I had a "chat" with a pizza seller on leicester square. Ordered 4 slices of pizza which he took and started to heat up, I pulled cash out and he said "card only". I told him I don't have a card and he asked me how I was going to pay. "by cash" I said," you have to pay by card" - I then replied " you have to, by law, declare it's a card or cash only transaction at the point of sale, which you didn't, so keep your pizza." (I wasn't sure if it is consumer law, but I thought I'd bluff it)

He wasn't best pleased as I walked away, and flashed my card at him.

On the flipside, my local chippy prefers cash, he's always asking for cash, in which I always reply "give us an extra scoop of chips and it's cash all the way!".

Edited August 18, 2022 by Butch

[Stillearly]

9 minutes ago, Butch said:

I had a "chat" with a pizza seller on leicester square. Ordered 4 slices of pizza which he took and started to heat up, I pulled cash out and he said "card only". I told him I don't have a card and he asked me how I was going to pay. "by cash" I said," you have to pay by card" - I then replied " you have to, by law, declare it's a card or cash only transaction at the point of sale, which you didn't, so keep your pizza." (I wasn't sure if it is consumer law, but I thought I'd bluff it)

He wasn't best pleased as I walked away, and flashed my card at him.

 

555 so you wanted Pizza , had a card or phone to pay for it , but didn't just to piss off the guy ...

I love the fact we can pay for almost anything by card or phone ... you don't end up with pocketfuls of coins at the end of an day out 

I have a huge whisky bottle full of coins , I haven't added much to it over the last few years , I used to empty it every year ... reminds me I should take it to the bank ... no need to bag it up anymore either , just pour it in the coin counter machine  

progress is a wonderful thing. 🙂